Michael Cummins and Arnold Moss, two names not instantly recognisable to the average student, but no doubt have played some role – however minor – in the lives of students for the last fifty years, as the two resident pharmacists in the Campus Centre Pharmacy – who have only just taken their well-deserved retirement. Having known each other from when they themselves were studying, we were sure they had plenty of stories to tell about their own lives, and life at Monash – and sure enough they delivered.
Aish: You’ve each spent 50 years together at Monash already. So what brought you here? How did you end up choosing pharmacy?
Michael: Well pharmacy, as a career path, we were forced to make a decision when we were in the old VCE, year 12, right.
Aish: So nothing has changed in 50 years…
Arnold: In those days you chose. Depending on your results you chose three courses that you could go into. Um I think Michael spoke on this but my results were good enough and I think his probably too, I got into medicine, I got into pharmacy, and I think I got into law as well. But I chose pharmacy because I thought it was going to be easy.
Michael: Same here.
Aish: Was it?
Arnold: Well we both got good results because as we said unfortunately we did a year of Honours because we missed out on first year pharmacy. Didn’t we Michael? Is that what we call it? So we did a year at Melbourne Uni and that was based on your VCE results or your matriculation results. So we got in after we missed out on first year pharmacy, we got into Melbourne Uni, and it was a few of us but Michel and I were the only ones that survived and went back into pharmacy. And that’s where our friendship really started at Melbourne Uni, so you know it was good. And then 50, 50 odd years later we’re still together. I’ve seen my kids come through here, he’s had kids come through, and now I’ve had my granddaughter here at Monash. I’ve had three kids and my granddaughter has been here for a year.
Aish: Did any of your kids follow your path?
Arnold: No, none of them. We told them to stay clear.
Michael: My son’s a physiotherapist and my daughter’s an intensive care nurse.
Arnold: Mine are completely different. Andrew, my daughter, does social work, she was the oldest. The middle one was a consultant in IT, he recruits for himself. And the little one – I say little one because we had him a lot later – he’s younger, he’s a lawyer, works at Seek. But he’s not in law anymore. Yeah, he’s in new business development. We certainly didn’t have any, well no, influence. We didn’t want our kids to do pharmacy. It was technical, it was too hard.
Michael: We let them choose their own way. But we do know someone in pharmacy that everyone else knows. We went through with the Gances, who own Chemist Warehouse.
Aish: Well, I mean you’ve been in the game long enough, I’m guessing you’re going to know people…
Arnold: Jack’s my age. He used to sit down the front and we used to sit up the back.
Michael: When you sit up the back of a lecture theatre it means something, doesn’t it.
Aish: I think it still means the same thing. I mean I sit up the back. So 50 years, that’s half a century – we’ll not focus on that don’t worry. But what are some differences that you’ve seen in terms of Monash’s growth? What are some things that you’ve taken away perhaps, or just want to highlight?
Michael: I’d probably say the students, and the student attitude hasn’t changed. Every year we get 4,000 new kids in. Every year these 4,000 kids are going to change the world. Every year, these 4,000 kids know exactly how things should operate because they’ve been taught that at school. And then they get here and all of a sudden find out the world acts a little bit differently to what you’ve learnt so far…
Aish: In the books.
Michael: …from your teachers or you know your education. It’s not what you think. But the kids initially when they come haven’t changed, haven’t changed at all. Bright-eyed, bushy-tailed, ready to learn, open-minded, ready to have fun.
Aish: Is that how you went into University as well, wanting to change the world?
Michael: No, I went in with great fears and trepidation. Because, I mean, when we finally got back to the Pharmacy College, back around the College was at Melbourne, we had to pass. There were no second chances. Everything had to be done. So we didn’t enjoy those years as much as we should have. But, we had to pass. We had to pass to stay, we did.
Aish: In the e-mail we received from your daughter, Nicole, she mentioned that you had some early editions of Lot’s Wife in your possession. I’m assuming that you’ve read a lot of the editions, and was wondering whether there were any editions that you found interesting?
Michael: Ones that would blow your socks off, if anyone ever saw them.
Aish: So Lot’s Wife used to be more controversial then?
Michael: Oh absolutely.
Angus: Definitely.
Michael: You’d run out of copies. As soon as Lot’s Wife hit the stands they’d be gone by night time.
Angus: I remember an editorial from the second or third edition of Chaos – Lot’s predecessor – in 1961, they’d come out on a Thursday and by Friday morning they’d be gone. And they were ordering 500 copies and this is when there were less than 600 students at the University. So it was incredibly popular. And by the ‘70s, they offered a service where if you paid a relatively cheap price they would mail you a copy. It’s amazing to me that there were people that engaged or still wanted to be engaged having recently graduated…
Michael: I think everybody wanted to be engaged, and if there’s a change that’s probably what it is. In those days, everybody not only wanted to do things, but wanted to be a part of it. Some of the Union Nights, they used to have, superb. I think I remember INXS, when they were first starting, they came into the tunnel downstairs and I happened to be in the goods lift and I said “What’s I-N-X-S?” because that was on their drums. I mean I didn’t know what I-N-X-S was, and that was before they became worldwide. And we have got some top-liners who came out. The student activists were very good at their jobs, very good.
Aish: So then, Lot’s Wife, do you think it shaped the culture of Monash or do you think Monash shaped the culture of Lot’s Wife?
Michael: I think Lot’s Wife was the voice of the students. If it was, offensive, direct, in your face, anti-establishment. Basically, I think that was the feeling of the students, and that was the feelings of the students putting themselves into a written document. So the students themselves were putting their voice down on paper. So that obviously influenced the majority of the student population I would have thought at the time. DId the University influence Lot’s Wife? Bloody hard to stop…
Aish: As retirement approaches, do you have any big plans for what’s next? Maybe taking up a new hobby or doing something unexpected? Is there anything you won’t miss?
Michael: Not having to sign documents for students. Particularly when in triplicate and late in the day.
Arnold: God no! Most people charge for documentation, but we’ve never charged.
Arnold: My wife said to me this morning “what are you going to do when you don’t have to worry about anything?” You always have to worry about something. I don’t think many of our friends are working at our age. God no. I must tell you It’s been the best partnership of my life. No one would last as long as we have together. It’s been 50-odd years together, marriages don’t last that long – sometimes. Ours have.
Michael: We’ve been lucky actually. Because our families and partners, our families have been very supportive.
Arnold: I think if you go through a job and enjoy it at the same time. I mean when we work there’s not a day we don’t talk to each other on the phone, have a laugh or something like that over the years. It’s been good fun. If you enjoy a job, it’s huge. It’s worth it, you know. If you don’t enjoy it, times will change.
Michael: Going back to what we were talking about earlier. The kids coming in, we’re old, we’ve been doing this for 50 years. Watching another 4,000 kids come in next week, if you don’t get a thrill out of that seeing these bright-eyed, bushy-tailed kids coming in and get a thrill out of it. But that hasn’t changed.
Arnold: You play along. Some are serious and come in. I’ve had people stop me sometimes and say “you were the pharmacist at Monash.” I was at Mornington one time having lunch, and he came up and said “you were the pharmacist at Uni, I have to thank you.” Out of context, I wouldn’t even know who people are but they do recognise us don’t they? It’s fun, it’s good fun being complimented. You know, we’ve had a pharmacy in suburbia, we used to run nursing homes. It’s been good.
Aish: Finally, what’s some advice for future students at Monash, or just some hopes for the future?
Arnold: You can answer that one.
Michael: No you can.
Aish: We can have them both.
Angus: I can perhaps string together some earlier discussion and suggest getting involved, engaging yourself with the University and what is on offer.
Arnold: Well I think, you know, I look at my granddaughter, so I have to advise her. Because she’s online for a lot of her subjects, she studies humanities and science. So for science she comes in, and humanities she goes online. She said to me once, that they have eight o’clock lectures. They never used to have eight o’clock lectures. Everything started at nine o’clock…
Aish: Oh they should bring that back. Please bring that one back.
Arnold: …And by eleven, 11:30, everyone wanted to come and have a coffee, enjoy and meet their friends there. That’s what they’re missing out on, you know. Just hang around the University a little bit more and meet people. Meet other people, not just the friends you’ve grown up with. You know, and that’s what happened in our year, you know, I met Michael and 50-odd years later we’re still good mates. I think that’s what they miss out on there. I think the University, it’s not just teaching, is it Michael?
Michael: I’d hope the University had learnt a lesson actually. Ever since COVID, and COVID killed us. The University had to do a hell of a lot to keep the whole thing going, and they did. But now they’ve lost the plot a bit. The staff only have to come in 60% of the time. The University should be a little bit more forceful with them, because 60% of the time the kids are missing out on 40% of the time of being at a university. They’re involved.
Aish: I guess that could be your hope for the years of students to come – that things will change.
Michael: Yeah, things will change, hopefully for the better. It can change, and there’s not that much that needs to be done by the young people, in order to make change happen.
Arnold: Things have changed. Our computers have changed. Our TVs have changed. When I talk to all my friends who went through university and they’re all professionals I used to love lunch times. I used to love lunch times, we’d have a game of cards outside or something like that. It was just a different way of integrating. And kids think that’s a waste of time. As I said, my granddaughter comes in at eight o’clock, and by 10:30am, she wants to go home. She’s done two hours of lectures, and goes home. Misses out the day here.
Michael: We used to do Tuesdays, where we’d start at 8:30am till 10:00pm, at night.
Arnold: Chem prac. Yeah, I used to do it with him, but that’s when we were at Melbourne. The funny story is I can talk more than he can. So he said to me we had to find a chemistry unknown in order to do chemical tests and all that stuff. He was a bit slack on the evening prac, and he said to me “I’ll go and see if I can look up the demonstrators notes, to see what our unknown is so we can go home early, you talk to him.”
Michael: I ran out of things to say!
Arnold: So we failed that one.
Michael: We got sprung.
Arnold: But that’s the fun you had. That one always stood out to me. But that’s how it is.
Aish: This has been a really insightful conversation and I know Angus and I have had a lot of fun. So thank you so much for your time today and I hope you enjoy the start of your next chapters in life.
Michael & Arnold : Thank you!
